I was having a discussion with a friend of mine and this topic came up. Their are many anime and manga where we see this cliche were a girl punches and hurts people who are far more powerful than them for a comedic effect an example when bulma punches goku. I know its all a joke but how did this cliche start in Japan that it is so prevalent in so many series. Is it funny in Japan where woman beat up men? I would like to know your thoughts on the matter.
Post by Powerlvlsrbullsh1t on Nov 11, 2019 1:35:38 GMT
Falbium, I've noticed this too, and I don't think it's completely unrelated to the fact that in a lot of anime, specifically shounen anime, it's the woman who actively pursues the man. And while we're at it, the fact that quite a few shounen series have guys practically faint and gush blood from their noses at even the slightest hint of nudity.
As for the whole power thing, I always think back on Krillin hurting Super Saiyan Goku by hitting him with a rock lol.
Powerlvlsrbullsh1t, you brought up some good points. I think the earliest anime i saw with the blood spurting out of the nose because of nudity was master roshi because he saw bulma lol. That scene still cracks me up when krillin did that to goku it was so silly that just a throw of a rock hurts goku a being at that point who could tank quite a bit of damage lol. The beating up cliche of men and nose bleed cliche has been around for decades and it does not seem like any time soon it will go away.
This trope isn't just found in shounen action titles. You can also find it in other demographics and genres like harem and romantic comedies. I believe the reason for this comes from elements of Japan's patriarchal society creating the belief that a good man won't hit a woman and the woman's tenacity in the relationship meant to show the couple's close relationship with one another. There are a good number of tsundere female characters that milk this trope to varying degrees within anime and manga, most notable examples being Inuyasha's Kagome Higurashi, Full Metal Panic's Kaname Chidori, and Love Hina's Naru Narusegawa.
Obviously if the genders were flipped, the violence of the act would carry more touchy developments and just shows how much of a double standard this trope is when trying to apply it in comical situations.
Someday I’ll be gone To somewhere that we belong And God has never played his role 'Cause I’m the one who saves my soul It’s a perfect world we’re longing for
Post by Powerlvlsrbullsh1t on Nov 11, 2019 2:33:00 GMT
Dream, It depends on the harem. In most harem anime you're right that this trope prevails, but then you have a halfway point like Touma from Index, who does get his ass beat by Index herself but also doesn't take shit from Misaka and actually defends himself from her attacks and will beat the fuck out of the villain regardless of their gender. Not to mention Accelerator.
Powerlvlsrbullsh1t : I didn't say the trope was in play for every rom-com or harem anime, per say. But for many titles that choose to play it safe and resort heavily to traditional anime cliches and character types, the character dynamic involving a tsundere being physically abusive to her male love interest or a Butt Monkey male lead being physically abused to varying degrees by his all-female harem are often brought into play with said titles for cheap laughs.
Post by Powerlvlsrbullsh1t on Nov 11, 2019 3:12:35 GMT
Dream, That is precisely why I prefer rom-coms that stray from that routine. I really disliked Nisekoi, Toradora and My Little Monster because of the never ending, constant use of that trope making the girls seem rather unlikable. If you want some great, somewhat lesser known but very unique romance manga, I've got two recomendations I think you'd like:
Asuperu Kanojo - A story in which the male main character is a borderline shut in porn artist in a loving relationship with his girlfriend who has severe Aspergers. Her mental illness is treated very maturely and realistically, and it's just really well written overall.
Oyasumi Punpun - Probably the best representation of being a kid I've ever seen. The main character, Punpun, and his family are all drawn as almost half assed sketches of birds, as opposed to every other character being a beautifully drawn, realistic human. The romance is between Punpun and the new girl in class.
Post by CosmicNoirTear on Nov 11, 2019 3:15:04 GMT
Falbium It became a mainstay comedy thing for shows with a huge female cast like the Harem genre which is over-saturated at this point so you inevitably see that type of humor in a lot of shows. Especially since the Japanese love their Tsundere archetypes.
Powerlvlsrbullsh1t Accelerator is definitely an example of gender equality, especially since one of those in Scavenger turned out to be a dude.
You forgot the most brutal example from Accel to this day where he blows a women’s face off point blank with a shotgun before dropping her into a hydraulic press machine
Post by Powerlvlsrbullsh1t on Nov 11, 2019 3:28:19 GMT
CosmicNoirTear, Funnily enough, almost immediately after I posted those Accel clips I went and rewatched the Hound Dogs scene. I forgot just how hardcore Accelerator went in that arc.
The gender equality thing of his doesn't just extend to his violence. It helps that the women around him are much more mature than the ones around Touma, with the obvious exception of Last Order because she's a literal child. Like the scene where he accidentally walks in on Yomikawa, Yoshikawa and Last Order naked in the shower. Instead of them freaking out or him freaking out, he just calmly asks why they didn't lock the bathroom if it was occupied, and the adults explain the reason equally calmly. It's perfect. Such a refreshing take on a scene that has gotten Touma's ass kicked so often.
The one show I can remember that goes opposite in terms of comedy rom com would be Aho Girl.
I would agree with Dream about the double standard thing.
Most of the the shows don't let the boys get away with perverted things and they get beaten. Some of you are probably familiar with Meliodas who gets away with it. That is one of them that strays from the trope. I do notice the reception towards Meliodas is mixed.
I think Ichigo doesn't get hit but Kon gets hit.
To add to the many reasons why the girls beat up the guys:
Accelerator has a harem just like Touma. As you pointed out, his situation inverts it. It does help that the women don't care (Esther) or are fine (the cop and the doctor) while Touma's love interests especially Last Order are violent.
I share Dream's stance on this trope except that this is also one of my least favorite, because it can wear out extremely fast (even in terms of comedy), especially in very grievous cases like Naru Narusegawa's. It's how some characters get on the very bad side of my shit list.
Taka: Thanks Master Menos! I'll work on finishing the Winter 2020 guide.
Jan 9, 2020 4:50:29 GMT
Dream: My second Funi poll is done. Titles I will be watching and reviewing will include Chobits, Samurai Champloo, Spice and Wolf, Gankutsuou, and Dance in the Vampire Bund. Will let folks know which one I start off tomorrow at some point.
Jan 11, 2020 5:39:30 GMT
Dream: First anime I will sample among the Funi titles is Chobits. As a heads up, the series on Funi's Youtube channel is missing the two recap episodes the series aired. Not that I'll be missing those however.
Jan 11, 2020 15:13:09 GMT
Dream: Wow, never knew Shinbo was Gil, Sousuke, and Domon. More you know.
Jan 11, 2020 17:52:00 GMT
Dream: Just completed Chobits. Will get a review up for it at some point this afternoon.
Jan 18, 2020 18:37:22 GMT
Dream: Will post a little later what the next voted anime will be that I will watch and review.
Jan 18, 2020 19:48:38 GMT
Dream: Next anime up to cover will be Dance in the Vampire Bund. Suppose a short anime will do for now following Chobits.
Jan 18, 2020 21:32:36 GMT
Dream: Concluding things at episode 2 with Vampire Bund for the night. Hoping to get back to Basquatch tomorrow, as long as I'm not swamped with anything.
Jan 19, 2020 3:00:33 GMT
Dream: Geez, it's really quiet. No activity in the forums since I posted my review from yesterday.
Jan 19, 2020 15:57:41 GMT
Taka: I'll email the receipts. The best anime and manga of 2019 will be extended to Wed. I don't get time off for Mon because of community service. Please vote if you haven't yet. Thank you!
Jan 19, 2020 20:44:07 GMT
Dream: Hmmmm... looks like the version of Vampire Bund I'm seeing on Funi's YouTube channel's an edited version. A couple minutes of episode 2 were clearly removed with Mina in nothing but underwear battling human assassins. Then again, recall there was a good...
Jan 19, 2020 22:49:15 GMT
Dream: ...deal of controversy with the series a decade earlier thanks to the seemingly underaged nudity of Mina while in her younger form.
Jan 19, 2020 22:50:13 GMT
Dream: Not sure if I should be donning the nostalgia goggles or not giving a damn. Looks like the original Digimon Adventure series is getting a reboot airing starting in the Spring season.
Jan 21, 2020 3:21:13 GMT
Taka: I'll watch it if there's nothing catching my eye in Spring. winter 2020 was a weak anime season for me.
Jan 22, 2020 18:29:46 GMT
Dream: Wouldn't say it's all bad for me. Have a few titles holding my interest. Just it typically doesn't have as many major titles of note that would hold me over.
Jan 22, 2020 23:54:44 GMT
Dream: Done with Vampire Bund. Will be working on a review of it before I hop into the next Funi series. Hoping to get it up either tonight or tomorrow, depending on how lengthy my thoughts get.
Jan 24, 2020 1:44:49 GMT